 Mixed Up - Mixed
I am very glad that I found this web site.I have read
almost all of the letters and they have been very
helpful. But now I need some help of my own. History: I
have been married for only 7 years. We have two small
children(4 & 3). For the past year my life has
changed dramatically.
I used to think that we had a very good marriage but
now I think that we were just very good at hiding all of
the pain. A year ago, I went outside of my marriage in
search of something. I've yet to determine what the
something was. After the affair was discovered, my
husband wanted to make it work, but I took it as an
opportunity to get out of a dead relationship. I left him
and the children and went on to pursue my new life.
I must admit, it was better than expected, at first,
but as I began to get serious with a new lover, I
realized that this was not the picture of marriage that I
had in my mind. As our relationship grew, I wanted him to
be apart of my entire life, which included my children.
The thought of having another man around my children is
what brought me back to my family. That is not how I
envisioned my children's lives. They did not deserve
this.
After a year apart, I decided to come back "for
the sake of the children". I told him that was the
only reason I was back and he agreed to that. He said
that he loved me and that he would wait until I was ready
to resolve our issues and get our marriage back.
He had been seeing some else during our break-up and
because I was not ready to let go of my other
relationship, we agreed to continue to see our lovers
until we got our marriage back on track. needless to say
this only lasted for a month. He became jealous of my
relationship and insisted that I end it. I told him I
would and for two months I actually did. But the only way
I found to be with my husband was to continue to see my
lover. I am still seeing my lover now. I know it is wrong
but it helps me get through the week with my husband.
I feel like Luise and Kelle of "Really, really
unsure of my relationship & my life" I feel that
I am scarifying my own happiest and that of my husband
for the sake of the children. I have read enough self
help books to realize that my affair is just a tool to
avoid the real issues in my marriage. My unwillingness to
work on my marriage is another way to avoid working on my
marriage.
My children's happiness is the most important thing to
me but am I really being fair to them by being in a
marriage that I am not respecting? I tell myself that
once my outside relationship is over, I will concentrate
on my marriage. But will another distraction be waiting
for me when this one is over. I have told my husband I am
not ready to "work" on our marriage. That I
will give what I can but I'm just not ready yet. He has
accepted this, which really surprises me.
Deep down I truly believe that my husband is probably
the best person for me and I should make this
relationship work. Religion, family and the sense of
being a failure, keep me from considering the possibility
of divorce.
I just do not know where to begin or what to do. Which
is evident by this long letter and my rambling. I know I
should seek individual counselling and I actually went to
8 sessions in 1996 but did not find them helpful. More
because I really did not want help. I just don't feel
ready to deal with my problems because I fear that they
may lead me to conclude that I should not be with my
husband and I just can not see doing that to my children.
Any help or insight that you could provide would be
appreciated.
 From: Bernd
The one question that sticks out for me in your
posting is “My children’s happiness is the most
important thing to me but am I really being fair to them
by being in a marriage that I am not respecting?” My
sense is that the person you are being most unfair to is
yourself, and it isn’t the marriage so much that you
“aren’t respecting” - it’s your own
inner voice, and your own sense of values and truth
inside you. That’s where the real harm lies, and
that is the example your children will very likely
emulate.
At the root of your own-going affair is your acute
awareness that your life is empty without love. Your
lover takes the edge off your emptiness, but my sense is
that continuing your affair also keeps you from doing any
real, permanent healing of that emptiness. An affair is
like an addiction; it kills the pain in the short run,
but there’s a price tag inside that keeps building
up, and eventually - to our horror - we end up paying for
it in ways we never expected. And often our children pay
part of that cost too.
You and your husband are both very likely carrying a
lot of heavy emotional baggage from before you ever met.
That weight tires both of you out, and distorts your
judgment, and keeps both of you crashing against each
other. You can’t do anything about your
husband’s baggage, but in beginning the process of
healing from yours, you can stop adding so much of yours
to his load. In our case, the less I crashed into Lynda,
the more able she was to find healing solutions of her
own, and vice versa. That is how we made it out of the
swamp.
The less genuine love we have for ourselves, and the
less sources we find for HEALTHY love, the more we
naturally resort to trying to find it in unhealthy and
self-destructive ways. Loving yourself means treating
yourself in many of the same ways an honest lover would.
This includes searching for anything that helps the
healing process, being honest with yourself, allowing
yourself to feel all your emotions without shame or
judgment, respecting your feelings and thoughts, and
finding friends and support networks that validate your
specialness. A good friend would gently, and without
judgment, tell you that what you are doing now isn’t
getting you what you truly want. They would also tell you
that there is always a solution, but sometimes it comes
in a whisper, so to hear it we need to learn how to trust
and be with that calm, special place inside us. A good
friend would tell you that none of us can do it alone,
and that there are others who are willing to share that
journey with us, through listening and sharing their
experiences.
When I began my “recovery”, I thought that
it would take me a long time, and be hard as hell. Well,
I was right, and I was wrong. What would be even harder
would have been finding myself five years older, and in
the same old swamp or worse. All the short cuts lead to
dead-ends, and the “long road” is actually the
shortest way. I have gained some valuable insights about
faith, love, acceptance, happiness, and many other things
that are important to me - and the truths that I’d
stumbled across keep working wonderfully well each day. I
don’t want to go back to the “easy route”,
ever.
Let go of the questions of whether or not you should
stay in the marriage, or what’s best for the kids.
Whatever is truly best for you, is truly best for
everyone else - including your kids, and your husband.
You haven’t had a lot of practice at finding out
what’s truly best for you, so begin learning and
searching for what that means. Consider a therapist like
a dress - sometimes you gotta go through a bunch of them
before you find one that’s just right for you.
You’ll know intuitively when you find the right one
for the part of the recovery path you’re on, and
you’ll also get gut feelings for when and if
it’s ever time to move onto a new one.
My way out of my swamp was frustrating, confusing, and
full of mistakes. That’s normal. Why should I expect
the route out to be any less difficult than the route
that got me in there? But each step I’ve taken has
brought me one step closer to solid land, to a place
where it’s safe and fun to dance around, and where
there’s a bit of magic under every tree. You know
that place exists for you too. Maybe it’s time to
find out where that little voice inside you is really
trying to lead you?:)
Hope this helps a little.
From: MZET
Boy, you sound just like my wife, though my
circumstances are a little different and not as drastic,
yet... I hope I can help you since I cannot directly help
my wife. All my offers of assistance to her are
interpreted as control, so I have decided to step back
completely. But since you and I are not married to one
another and since you asked for insight, maybe you
won’t interpret my suggestions as control…and
maybe you will be able to help us or someone else back
some day.
Here’s what I’ve learned so far:
Our children (and a nagging voice telling us not to
get divorce) is also what’s kept us from a divorce.
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that
or demeaning to your husband or your relationship. In
fact, if you think about, it is a beautiful reason: that
the children, the physical manifestation of the love you
once had for one another are still bringing you back.
That’s powerful stuff.
I have also told my wife that I love her and that I
would wait (forgiveness is another matter, a very
difficult and long process also). She is now dealing with
the pain of not being able to see her lover. We’re
not sure she’ll get over it, but she’s trying.
It was her choice to leave the lover. Yes, her family
pressured her. Yes, her conscience may have dragged her
back. Yes, I also pressured her, but eventually I gave
up. And yes, I am also sure she was somewhat conscious of
the pain she was inflicting on me, but ultimately it was
her decision.
I think you need to make that same decision, that is,
if you want to save the marriage and avoid more pain to
you, your children, your husband and your lover. There is
no other way around it. It is a decision. Having an
affair is like being addicted to drugs. My wife tried to
quit three times. But you make a decision and you quit
seeing your lover because you want to, not because you
"feel" like it. The break up needs to be
surgical: tell your lover goodbye, that you are going to
work on your marriage, that he shouldn’t wait for
you and that he should get on with his life and other
relationships. You have to do it with the conviction that
you will work on yourself and your marriage 100% and that
you will never see your lover again.
Then you’ll go through hell (and everyone else
around you). But you’ve got to hang on (and so does
your husband), and you’ve got to avoid the
temptation to run back to your lover. Even a phone
conversation can take you back to square one. I have read
that it can take up to a year to get over the depression
of not seeing your lover. Remember, your feelings WILL
change, but expect to feel sad, lonely and hurt. These
will be the darkest nights of your soul. But one has to
suffer and die before coming back to life. If you are
religious at all, hanging on to your spiritual life will
help.
During this time, your husband MUST also work on his
side of the problem. This is something that you can read
about in this forum in some of the responses from Bernd.
Your husband must avoid anger, disrespect and demands and
give you space, space, space, as much as you need,
despite the pain, the perceived risk and the impatience
he will feel. It is a superhuman task, I am telling you.
In my own experience, only by holding on to one’s
spiritual life, can this be done. Tell him it will be
hell all over again for him also, but that you will give
it a 100% effort.
And whether he likes it or not, he needs to recognize
that you had an affair because he failed to meet some
very important needs met. He needs to listen to you,
needs to change and needs to give it an all out effort
also.
This needs theme and the addiction theme are two that
the Marriage Builder’s website (http://www.wife.com/)
emphasizes. I recommend you read every single page from
that website, especially the Q &A sections on
infidelity. Like you, I have read everything there is to
be read on this theme, and Dr. Harley from Marriage
Builder’s has the best practical insights I have
ever encountered, along with Bernd’s and
Lynda’s.
You also need to dig very deep inside and find out why
you had an affair. You need to find out two things: One,
what needs was your lover meeting that were so important
to you? And related to that, what were the specific
problems you were having with your husband that you may
never have told him about? And two, what is that
something you were searching for ? Or better yet, what is
the source of your desire to seek that something (because
I’m not sure we ever find what we are looking for
but we can at least understand why)? And don’t seek
outside of yourself, you already found that the affair
didn’t help you in that respect. Seek from within.
Dig deep. This is perhaps where individual therapy can
help you. Don’t give it up, and don’t think
that the results will be instantaneous. The road to
recovery is very bumpy.
Then the next critical phase is to recognize that you
had an affair because you failed to communicate these
things to your husband. You need to come out of your
shell. Nobody can force you to take that step. Your
husband will need to be incredibly patient. But I would
hope that eventually, little by little, you will crawl
out. This act of communicating will also be painful to
your husband. The few times my wife has talked to me in
the past two weeks I have felt literally sick to my
stomach. It’s been great for the waistline J,
however…But remember, there is no way around it.
You’ve got to go through it. Only then can your
husband begin to take in the information, change and
begin to meet those needs. And only then, once those very
important needs are being met, only then, will you be
able to fall in love with your husband again. Your
falling in love happens, I think, later, after you work
through all these steps, not before. You do not fall in
love with him first and then you begin to work on the
marriage. You do not wait for the "feelings" of
romantic love to be there and then say, wow, now I can
work on this relationship. That sounds like is the way it
should be but I am afraid it is also the impossible way.
It will never happen in that order. I keep telling that
to my wife but to no avail. I am afraid at times she
waits for the task at hand to become "natural"
or easy.
Now, if after all of that effort your husband does not
want to or cannot meet those needs, or if you are not
willing to give it a 100% effort to give up your lover,
then all bets are off and perhaps a divorce may be the
only way to be fair to your children. But I think your
children deserve an all out effort on both of your parts
first. Remember, your feelings will change, and you will
fall in love with your husband, but the road to get to
that possibility is a difficult one and it requires a lot
of work. It won’t come easy or naturally.
I also think that after going through this hell and
after you have re-established your love for your husband,
both of you will be extremely careful to make sure that
you have your needs met by the other. In other words, you
will "affair proof" your marriage, to use one
of Dr. Harley’s terms. The thought you expressed,
between the lines, about the risk of another affair is a
real fear, my wife has it also, but it is a distraction
from the immediate task at hand.
Your fear that you will conclude that you should not
be with your husband is unfounded. It is more likely that
you just don’t want to live without your lover
because you are addicted to him. Besides, the divorce
will only take place if he is not willing to gain back
your love. And from what you wrote, he is willing. Give
him a chance and help him; teach him how to meet the
needs your lover was meeting. Teach him how to love you
and you will love him back. And it will be better than
anything else you’ve experienced before.
I am not sure what I have said makes sense or if it is
guaranteed, but it is the only path I see one can take.
From my perspective, it is the road less travelled, the
"difficult" that the poet Rainer Maria Rilke
talks about: that we must embrace the difficult precisely
because it is difficult, that love is good, love being
difficult, and that to love another person is the most
difficult task, the one for which everything else is but
preparation.
I hope this helps a little.
From: Bernd
Wow! Where were you Mzet when I was going thru MY
hell????:)
So much of what you said rang echoes inside me, and
brought back lots of memories of the struggles I had. But
there is one thing that I found worked the OPPOSITE way
of how I thought it should. And that's needing,
expecting, wanting the spouse to work on THEIR problems.
In my case, that need and desire kept me in the
quicksand, instead of helping the marriage. What I've
discovered going thru that struggle is that I had to let
go COMPLETELY of wanting any change from Lynda - a huge
leap of faith. But in hindsight, it makes all the sense
in the world. I didn't know what my own needs were, and I
was so tangled up in trying to figure out what to heal,
and why, that looking for any change from her led me back
to the slippery slope of codependency, where I'd fall
over and over again. Here's the facts, the way I see
them. When one partner heals, that process alone makes
"non-recovery" extremely difficult for the
partner. It's like having one partner build a cosy fire -
the other partner gets awfully uncomfortable keeping
their coat on as long as they stay close.
As one partner heals, the contrast between their
increased peace of mind and serenity becomes all too
obvious to their partner. In fact, in AA, many marriages
break up AFTER the alcoholic begins achieving true
sobriety, because the alcohol no longer distracts the
non-drinking partner as much from their own inner turmoil
from past pain.
What I've found, from my own experience and that of
others, is that the non-recovering partner's emotions and
life usually spiral out of control even more, as their
partner heals. In other words, things SEEM to get worse,
instead of better. I say "seem", because it's
actually a very necessary part of the process. Before we
are willing to make the huge leap in faith and commitment
to deal with old buried pain, our lives have to become so
unmanageable that we reach the crossroads of "begin
recovery", or "fall completely apart".
That's the way it is, it just is.
There were many times I - and Lynda - were ready to
give up trying. It wasn't the "feeling of
love", no siree, that kept us hanging in there. It
was that damn little voice inside us, that kept telling
both of us "hang in there, it's worth it". I
had made a commitment to find out how love worked, and
that's the one I kept following. A commitment to learn
how to love myself first, because I can only give what I
own.
Expect things to get worse. Rejoice in it, bless it.
Leave your partner's recovery to them and God. It will
all make perfect sense one day, but first we all have to
give ourselves time to "unlearn" those things
that keep getting us back into the swamp. Your partner
wants inner peace, love and happiness too. When they see
you getting more of all that, they'll struggle mightily
to keep deluding themselves that there's a shortcut, but
eventually, truth has a way of knocking us all over the
head with a 2x4.:)
Whew! Enough from me!
From: MZET
I hate to have to agree with you. I want a short cut
for my wife sooo badly. I know there are none.
I know I have to LET GO of my partner. Totally. I know
I have to heal myself, too. I intuit that only when I am
finally able to be at peace with myself and the pain and
fear of letting go, only then and only that will create
the environment within which my wife can heal.
I know that communicating to my spouse my desire to
want to see her work on her problems or worse, my direct
attempts to "fix her up", do not work and
worse, backfire.
I know all of that. Embracing it is another matter.
My parents have a sculpture that I never understood as
a teenager. It represents a marriage: It is crucifix
wherein the one crucified is a woman. She is crucified
not to a cross but to a man with his arms extended as a
cross.
I often think of that image. I think I finally
understand.
From: Bernd
I'm keep being silently amazed at how much impact your
posts have on me. My gut feeling is that you're very much
on the right path. It will come. After all, if we had
everything we wanted, where would we put it?:)
From: Kelle
No doubt you're right, MZET, about me not meeting some
of my spouses needs,either. (Of course I KNOW you're
right.)
I really appreciate the fact that in this forum, Bernd
and Lynda can speak as a couple who have been there (and
have recovered nicely!). . . and also that there are
people like you who can help us broaden our perspective.
It keeps this from being just a husband-bashing exercise.
Believe me, I take very seriously all the good advice
that you respondents take the time to write. THANKS!
From: Mixed
Thank you for your response. Several comments you made
really hit home. I agree that I must make a decision
regarding my lover. But I am afraid of the
"hell" you spoke of that I will go through
without him in my life. The first time I ended the
affair, I began to resent my husband for
"making" me chose between the two. This was not
good for our relationship. We began to fight and I did
not care to be in the same room with him. At least now
that I am seeing my lover again, I enjoy being around my
husband. I am able to tolerate my husband because I know
that what he does not give me, I will get from my lover
when I see him. If it was not for my lover, my husband
and I would never have sex. But because of the quilt I
feel, I am able to bear having sex with my husband. (Yes,
the lack of sexual fulfilment is one of our problems).
But what I know more than anything is that all of this is
just an excuse not to work on my marriage
You talked about my husband giving me space. Part of
me believes this is part of the whole problem. I have
been given too much space throughout our entire marriage.
I have taken advantage of his love for me and his overall
gentle nature. Maybe I need less space but I also realize
that I can not blame him for my behaviour. If I know I am
doing something wrong, I should not continue that
behaviour just because I am allowed to.
I guess I just want my cake and eat it too. I am not
ready to make an 100% effort to my marriage and it is
partly because I do not feel I "have" to.
Sometimes I think I will only commit after I am caught
again or that I am waiting to get caught so that my
decision will be made for me. My husband has stated if he
finds out I have had another affair, he would probably
leave me.
I am also aware that I have alot of unresolved
relationship issues that I brought to this marriage. Most
of it has to do with my perception of a perfect marriage
which of course I got from my parents. But as I have gone
through my own problems, I have realized that their
marriage was in no way perfect and in fact my parents
stayed together for the sake of the children and are
currently living in separate rooms of the house.
What amazing me about this whole situation is that I
am aware of all of my problems and understand the cause
of most of my actions but it as though I can not do
anything about them. I just want them to magically go
away even though I know that is not how it will happen.
It is like you said, I will not just wake up one day and
be in love with my husband again. We must first resolve
our individual issues, or at least work on them, them
work on our marriage before the love will come back. I
just feel frozen in place. As though I can not make a
move. That I realize I am sinking and I see the rope that
will save me but I will not reach out for it.
I just hope that I reach out for the rope before I
ruin everyone's life.
I will take your advice and soul search for the
answers to why I am having an affair and what I believe I
am in search of.
Thanks again for the very thoughtful advice. I will
keep you posted.
From: MZET
My wife also resented me, almost hated me, for feeling
that I was making her chose between me and her lover.
Only when I was able to say that leaving her lover was
not a condition for my wanting to get a divorce did the
resentment stopped. But we have not made love (how can we
if there is no love!) or even kissed since we both
confronted the affair four months ago. She just cannot
get herself to be intimate with me. She continues to feel
very strongly about that. :(
She also came up with the same excuse you have that
the affair is good for the marriage because at least that
way she can be good to me, whatever that means: sex,
intimacy, communication, etc. I felt otherwise, however.
I just knew the passion was not there and that the whole
thing was a farce. I’d rather have her be authentic
to herself and to the marriage, even if it means distance
from me, even if it means separation or even divorce. I
think she also would rather be authentic, and I can tell
you would too.
I also gave my wife an incredible amount of space
during our marriage. But that was not the problem. I also
had a lot of space and felt that was good. The problem is
more what we do with that space. But that’s another
subject. When I talk about space during recovery, I mean
that while you are recovering from the addiction to your
lover, you will need space. At least my wife does. Any
attempt from your husband to come close to you unless you
are ready for it may backfire, especially attempts to
change you. I am trying really hard to not even want or
need to change her.
Yes , you want your cake and eat it too. That’s
what my wife wanted (or still wants, I guess). But
it’s an illusion of stability. And in the process
you are hurting yourself and are inflicting an almost
unbearable amount of pain to your husband. And the more
you wait, the closer you get to the brink of disaster.
You DO "have" to face reality, eventually. That
little voice inside of you is talking to you and you are
listening. I can tell. The longer you wait the harder it
will be. Remember, you are addicted, and it does come
down to a rational decision of the will, not a feeling.
I don’t know what your husband will do if he
finds out again. I’m not sure you’ll stop with
more threats or even if he finds out. I threatened my
wife with divorce three times; each time I really meant
it. But threats do not work. In the end she made her
decision to continue the affair despite of the threats,
but stopped only when I stopped the threats. Odd,
isn’t it?
My wife also felt (and feels) the same way you do as
she was struggling to make a decision: frozen. To her,
like you, it wasn’t really a matter of not knowing
which way to go, but more a matter of facing the hell of
not being with her lover. But if you are not giving your
husband a chance to give you what your lover is giving
you, if you do not teach him how to love you, how can you
ever get out of the hell and fall in love with your
husband again? You are in a prison and you have the key
to get out and enjoy reality. Use it.
You say you feel that you are sinking and see the rope
that can save you right there, within reach. You probably
have touched it already. It reminds me of an image from
"The Piano", the movie. Did you see it? The
main character is sinking into the ocean entangled with a
rope attached to her piano and, after having lost all
will to survive, somehow, after what seems a hopeless
eternity, she gathers the strength to free herself and
swim to the surface.
I hope you (and my wife) do the same.
From: Kelle
MZET--I hope your wife does, too. Otherwise, she is
obviously missing out on something good. While you are
obviously and admittedly human, your perceptions here are
pretty enlightening to us all. Please hang around for a
while. . . there's still plenty we can learn from you!
From: luise
boy MZET, I've been to numerous counsellors and you
make more sense than any of them. There is so much truth
in what you say and I know it, however, there is always
ONE thing in any advice, self help books, etc. that
doesn't pertain to me and that is the fact that I was
never in love with with my spouse in the beginning. Why
did I marry? I had come off of a relationship when I was
17 and "in love" but he went to college and met
someone else. I was crushed and never really got over the
hurt until years later. Unfortunately for my spouse, we
met not too long after the breakup when I went to
college. He was so much fun and I laughed so much that I
thought this was so much better than
"closeness". We dated off and on for 4 years
because he pursued me but I always broke it off because I
was never certain. However, after college and he was
still pursuing I made the "decision". I was a
virgin and felt that the closeness would happen. When
fireworks didn't go off added to the fact that I had
married an overly critical perfectionist and someone who
did not want to be close to my family or have anything to
do with my father(I wanted my spouse to be like a son to
my dad) I pushed the hurt away so much because I'm a
peacemaker and wouldn't consider a divorce. As you
mature, you realize how unhappy your life is and in your
late 30's begin to realize that life is in fact very
short. Entrapment and depression set in. This was 4 years
ago. If I had loved my spouse in the beginning I think I
would be more inclined to work harder at the marriage. He
has made some great improvements in the way he treats my
family now and has become much less critical, but it took
3 years of prodding to make these changes and I feel they
are partly due to wanting me off his back. We have 2
wonderful children 13 and 15, good kids, and I want them
to stay that way. I'm afraid splitting up our family
could change that and am willing to suffer quietly for at
least 5 more years. At that point, I'm afraid to think
about what I may do or feel so I just keep going through
the motions. NOW, do you have any more advice or do you
feel sorry for me like many of the counsellors I've seen?
I'm not trying to be flippant, it's just that there is no
acceptable answer for me.
From: MZET
I’ve thought over and over about your case: You
never loved your husband. OK. Case closed? You
wouldn’t be in this forum if you thought so. Cheer
up! There is hope !:)
The more I think about it the more I feel that perhaps
your case is not that different from that of someone
falling out of love with his or her spouse during an
affair. I can tell you that my wife currently wonders if
she ever loved me and she cannot imagine she ever will. I
think if you read about others who have had intense
emotional affairs, you will find that to some, that is
also the case. So I am not sure that trying the same
approach (dig deep and look at what emotional needs your
husband is not meeting, then talk to him about them and
ask him to change so that they are met, etc.) would not
work. And I am not sure there is any other way. You may
find that as soon as he meets those needs you will fall
in love with him, for the first time!
And why just go through the motions for the next five
years? Wouldn’t that be a waste of your time,
however noble the desired outcomes of not splitting the
family or not hurting the kids are? Will you have grown
during those five years? Will you have found out
something about yourself? Suffering quietly for the next
five years and not doing anything is not really
suffering. It’s something else...…perhaps
giving up or accepting defeat, but NOT suffering.
It’s like the parable of the talents Jesus talks
about. The one who did not put the talents to work was a
loser in the end. It’s the same with suffering. Put
it to work. What you have now is, I believe, a talent or
a gift in disguise. It’s telling you something about
yourself. Can’t you see that? If you don’t try,
if you don’t look, if you call it quits, you’ll
never know what this is saying about you and you’ll
never know if you can actually love your husband; and in
the end, you will have thrown away all those years.
You’ve got to try harder. The reward is just too
big. And if it does not work after really trying, then
you go to Plan B in five years, like I hear you say
between the lines….
Anyway, I also have the feeling you think that being
in new relationship or by yourself will be more
fulfilling in the long run. We tend to repeat our
mistakes in relationships unless we work on our current
ones. If you don’t learn from the current one you
will fall into the same trap in the next one. I think
that’s why those who divorce and marry someone else,
have a much higher chance of a second divorce.
I can also tell you that I never really loved my wife,
that is, unconditionally, until after eight years of
marriage, and that I never really really loved her,
unconditionally and with a letting go attitude until now,
twelve years into the relationship. I mean, I had fun
with her, we enjoyed each other, we had that
"romantic feeling" before we got married, etc.
but true, mature love? Not so sure it was there.
Plus love is more than just a romantic feeling. It is
a decision. Feelings are fleeting and change rapidly. I
am convinced feelings of romantic love exist in our minds
for strict evolutionary and Darwinian reasons: to
procreate. But you cannot base a long term relationship
on those feelings alone. After the game of procreation is
over, after the honey moon is over, the work of loving
really begins.
You are closer than you think. Imagine if you had to
deal with the nightmare of an affair. That complicates
things a thousand fold. You are a step closer than a lot
of us. It seems as if your husband has changed and I
don’t see why he wouldn’t want to change some
more in order to save the marriage. You need to take the
next step. What do you have to lose?
Take care.
From: luise
Thanks so much for your quick responses! I must be
blind as a bat because I don't know to which talents you
are referring to about me that you think will help me
help myself. I have told my spouse many times what
emotional needs he does not meet. I've also told him the
HE too needs counselling not just with me but by himself.
He has been a couple of times but he hates it and I'm
tired of suggesting and dragging him along. He comes from
a very mixed up family: parents divorced when he was
sick, both remarried and his father moved 600 miles away.
His stepdad cheated on his mother (he saw them) and his
mother died when he was in college. I know that I wanted
to give him the family he never had and when he rejected
mine I was so hurt. I made a wrong choice and I have
prayed and prayed to fall in love with him over the years
and I guess I got to the point a few years ago where I
stopped trying and just got the help I needed to get
through this. I totally understand what you are saying
(except for my talent!) and in 4 years of therapy with
many different counsellors I can't see any change in my
feelings except for a general acceptance that my life is
not so bad....I'm just not thrilled.
From: MZET
I guess I know what you are saying. It takes two to
tango and if he is really not willing to change, there is
very little hope. Only a crisis will wake him up. I just
hate to see him (and you) suffer when it would be so easy
to try to change now. But God has a way of working in
mysterious ways...
The talents I refer to have noting to do with your
abilities, which I am sure you have, but more on
recognizing the current situation as a challenge for
growth. My point is don't give up during the next five
years. Use that period in a productive way.
Take care.
From: CINDY
The truth sometimes hurts and it is clear to me that
your life has been a constant merry-go-round. You can't
face the fact that you want your cake and eat it to. Your
children will survive what ever decision you make. Sure
it's hard for them, but if there's no love between you
and your husband, they will know. Children are much
smarter then most people give them credit for. My advise
to you is to STOP using your children as a scapegoat.
Your hiding behind them and won't realize the true
problem is your own insecurities.
From: Mixed
I disagree that my life has been a merry-go-round. The
way I classify my life is one of always trying to do the
right thing. Trying to live up to everyone else's opinion
and expectations. Trying to be the good daughter, the
good wife and the good mother. When I left home a year
ago, that was one of the most liberating experiences of
my life. I had to put up with everyone telling me I was
doing the wrong thing. But at the time, I felt that what
I was doing was right. But later I realized I was just
being very selfish.
In addition, I am not using my children as a
scapegoat. I am using my children as the motivating
factor for me to honour the commitment we made to them
when we brought them into this world. (Not to blame them
for the way my life has turned out which is what
scapegoating means - one who bears the blame for others).
We commitment to provide a safe, secure and loving
environment for them to grow in. But to honour my
commitment to my children,I need to also honour the
commitment I made with my husband to stay with him for
better or worse. I am trying to think about someone's
feeling other than myself. I am trying to weigh the
effects that leaving versus staying would have on their
lives. Trust me, I have done alot of homework on children
of divorce. I have talked to more people who are products
of divorce and also those who are products of living in a
house with no love. My research says that the majority of
the people I spoke with said they would rather their
parents stay together as long as there was no violence or
disrespect than get a divorce.
Because I do not know the future, I am very insecure
about how my decision will affect their lives so
therefore, I must make the best decision I can now. That
is to work on my marriage. True I am not ready to work on
it yet, but I am not ready to throw it all way just yet
either.
That is why I am seeking the advice of others to help
me see how I can make this marriage work and bring back
the love to our marriage. I know that I at least owe it
to my children to at least give it a try. So until I do
that, I guess in your opinion, I will continue to use
them as a scapegoat.
From: luise
Dear mixed......I read your post and thought "did
I write this?" No kidding, between you and kelle,
the three of us must be an awful lot alike. I have been
the good, dutiful wife, the good mother, the dependable
daughter, but I'm so disappointed that I am not happy.
Mostly I', not happy in my marriage. I live for my kids
and it scares the heck out of me to think that in 5 years
they will be 18 and 19. I fear that I will stay here even
then because I want them to have our home to come to on
college breaks, etc. But all those days in between
college visits will be what for me? I feel like a wimp
but it's the principals that I believe in and was raised
by. No divorce in my immediate family and since my
husband and I get along most of the time it's hard to
think about splitting up. I know this sounds awful but at
times I have almost wished he'd have an affair! I think
I'll change my name here to Crazy Luise!
From: cindy
Hi, I guess I should have said more then I did in my
last response, so here goes. I completely understand what
your feeling, but to stay together just for the children
isn't fair to them and most of all to your husband. What
you have to understand first and foremost why you strayed
from your marriage in the first place. When a women
doesn't feel loved, cared for, respected, or if she is
verbally abused like I was, you will look for some other
king of security, love or companionship somewhere else.
Most times, it's with another man. I had an affair with
another man and ended it a short time later because my
children didn't deserve it, or my husband. I felt if I
got it out of my system, thing would get better. They
only got worse. As a women matures she realizes what she
wants and what the needs from their partner. Alot of
those things their partner can't give. It's only after
years of maturity and a lot less of thinking about what
he needs and more about what you need, is when you will
finally make the final decision to leave for good. Your
children deserve 2 loving parents to raise them. They
need to see love and respect between you and your
husband. That is what setting a good example is about.
Not you going out, coming home and pretending your life
is a bed of roses. Your children will sense it and know
the difference. If there to young now to understand, they
will know soon enough.
My children now see their father as often as they want
because I felt they needed that extra security. I was
right, they are adjusting just fine, my daughters marks
are A++++ and my son is doing very well. My life has been
different to say the least, but I'm happy and content
with myself and with my children. My boyfriend is a part
of my life but we don't live together. That is something
I can't elaborate on because as far as I'm concerned, my
children have had enough adjusting in their lives so why
disrupt that by moving in with someone. In time maybe,
but for now we are all happy the way thing are including
their father. Sorry if I sounded cruel in my last
message. I was just trying to make a very strong but
honest point. Take it from someone who's been there.
There is happiness out there.
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