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 Confused and hurting - Jess
Hi there everyone. I'm going through a very difficult
time and I just don't know what to do...I might as well
start at the beginning. about 2 months ago I became
involved with a close friend. We've known each other
since September having met through a mutual friend and
have been good friends since. the start of our
relationship was a big surprise to both of us- we were
out looking for something to do and somehow we ended up
kissing. WE realized we had both been attracted to each
other for some time. The relationship continued on very
well for about 3 weeks.
One night he got extremely quiet and said that we
needed to spend some time apart. I asked what what was
wrong and he told me I didn't want to know. We talked a
few days later and he told me that we were too different
and that it could never work between us. He told me that
all his life he's told himself that he wants to spend the
rest of his life with someone who understands him and is
just like him. He basically said that we're complete
opposites and all he wanted to do was salvage the
friendship. At this point it became too much for me- I
KNEW he had feelings for me- it was very obvious. I told
him that I KNEW he had feelings for me and that we COULD
salvage the relationship. He agreed to for my sake but
told me that the issue would come up again. well
everything was going just fine for a few days- I was
convinced that he had realized how stupid he had been and
everything was just fine. We both have high morals
concerning premarital sex and were both virgins, however,
we did have sex once. I thought that this cemented the
relationship even further- but a few days later the
"issue" came up again. We both decided to
compromise- we would be "just friends" for a
week and see how things go and then discuss things this
weekend. well...he has been at my house every minute we
both aren't at classes.
He's over even more often now then while we were
together. The strange thing is that he doesn't spend most
of this time with me- he spends it with my younger
sister. I find this very very strange. I have extremely
strong feelings for him but I have no idea what he's
thinking. I KNOW he has feelings for me, I just don't
understand any of this. He doesn't seem to realize that
anything is wrong between us- he's more cheerful then
ever. Although we agreed to talk this Friday night he has
already made plans to do something with my younger sister
(she's 13,he's 18). He seems to think that this problem
will go away and it WON"T. I want to work this out-
I love him and I know that altho he's very confused he
has feelings for me as well. If he doesn't want that then
I would be fine being friends but not like it is now...it
seems like he can't choose and being up all the time but
not spending the time with me is some kind of a
compromise for him. I feel like he almost LIVES here he's
over so often. If you're reading this, please just tell
me what you think of the whole thing. I just don't know
what to think anymore...I thought I had everything
figured out between us but now I have no clue. thank you
 From: Cindy
Hi Jess, I can't tell you what he's thinking but it
sounds like he likes your sister. What is he going out
with your sister instead of you. When a person is not
happy around you and then all of the sudden he or she
changes moods when a particular person enters the room,
that usually indicates something is wrong. It could be
also that he's trying to make you jealous buy using your
sister. If that's the case and you want to find out if
that's what he's doing. Try this out. Whatever day your
sister and he has plant, casually say you have your own
plans with someone else, even though you were invited to
go our with them. See his reaction. I bet you the next
day he'll call you to find out what you were doing and
who you went out with. If he has no reaction try it
again. Your being a little deceitful, but after all, you
need to know what he's up to. If he really does like your
sister, you will see it. Maybe he doesn't know what he
want, if this is true, it should not be a the expense of
you or your sisters feeling. I hope this works for you.
Let me know.
From: Bernd
Like Cindy, I suspect that he is dealing with some
kind of emotional attachment to your younger sister. The
statement "I asked what what was wrong and he told
me I didn't want to know" could very well be a
"read between the lines" clue to that.
That's my hunch, and it may very well be off in left
field, but my best reading of my intuition tells me
there';s some truth to that.
Check out what YOUR gut feelings are telling you. If
you are getting the same kinds of readings, read on. If
not, ignore t5he rest of this, and give me a little more
insight into what's happening at present between you and
him, and him and your sister.
Ok, here's my thoughts if you decided to read on. It's
his choice, and your sister's choice, over who they wish
to spend time with, including time with each other. It's
their right to make such choices too. However, it's also
YOUR right to refuse to be the buffer, unknowing
accomplice, or the "middleman" in their
relationship. I suspect that if you confront him with
what you suspect, he may decide to be very adept at
obscuring, hiding, and manipulating the version of the
truth he wants you to see. Don't get into the
"logic" trap, because it's unwinnable. I'd
suggest taking some time to really get a feel for YOUR
gut feelings about what is going on, talk to some trusted
friends about your hunches, and then let him know what
things about his behavior and choices you'll no longer
accept, and what things you're ok with. Then DO whatever
is best for YOU.
Your sister is NOT to blame here, or at any fault.
She's 13, and her maturity level simply isn't up to
seeing what's going on in a clear and honest way. No
matter how mature she tries to act, or seem, she is NOT
at fault. He is the adult here, not her.
It may also seem a bit confusing. When does a
friendship with a child stop being a healthy friendship-,
and become an unhealthy "relationship"? I don't
know of any clear answers, but I do know there are some
clues which can help us get closer to the truth. A
significant change in the person's PRIMARY love
relationship is a very probable tipoff; dishonesty,
subtle evasion or secrecy is another. And even though
their friendship is probably operating on a physical
non-sexual level, I suspect that there are
"sexualized" emotional parts to it. By
sexualized, I mean things such as mannerisms, body
signals, and kinds of physical touching that knowingly
trigger sexual feelings. The young teenage years unleash
a whole range of new feelings, and I suspect that part of
your sister's attraction to him comes because those
feelings come alive more in his presence - something
which I suspect he knows full well.
As much as a "friend" that he's been to you,
we often (unfortunately) see a much truer picture of
people when they get closer to us. You both are dealing
with "love" as a feeling first, and a choice
second, and I think that is certainly a part of what's
causing both of you problems. Read my posting on
"Love versus the feeling of love", and see if
any of it strikes any echoes inside you.
Finally, there's not a whole lot you can do to control
any relationship between him and your sister. About the
only thing I know that helps is gentle, firm honesty -
with yourself, and her, and eventually him. If she knows
you're going to be honest with her about what you see,
without judging or condemning her, it WILL sink in. It
has to take it's own amount of time. The safer she feels
turning to you, the better chance she has of seeing that
you really do care about her, and she'll be able to learn
some difficult lessons without beating herself up in the
process.
Please, take what feels right, and leave the rest out
of anything I said. Find time to really listen to your
heart, and talk to good friends and you'll find the
answers you're looking for. Anything I said that feels
close to the truth will simply help you in trusting those
whispers inside.
Good luck. Let us know how you you make out.
From: cindy
I do agree with what your saying. But remember there
both just learning. She can be as mature as she wants,
and talk to as many people for some insight, but if he
wants his cake and wants to eat it to, I don't think he's
going to be completely honest either way. Actions speak
louder then words. Sometimes when a person is confused
about his or her feeling, you sometimes need to make them
realize what it is they want. A little persuading is
sometimes needed.
From: Jess
no...he's not romantically involved with my sister at
all. that's one thing I'm sure of...altho the fact that
he spends sooo much time with them does bother me. He
"adopted" her and her best friends as his
sisters early in our relationship. They all enjoy
breeding guinea pigs so usually they're out going to a
breeders house or the pet shop or something. he says that
he likes being around her and her friends because they're
so young and fun to be around because they're so
immature- he says older people are boring. in fact, he
doesn't even like going out and doing stuff with people
our own age anymore- we used to ALWAYS do things with our
other similar-aged friends. Anyways...I mentioned to him
earlier this evening that we needed to talk...he
responded by saying "talk? about what?". he
said that if the only thing I was going to tell him was
how much I still wanted to be with him, he didn't want to
talk. in response I told him that by not talking to me
and acknowledging my feelings he was showing me that he
didn't care at all- he told me that he did care (and I do
believe him- but that confuses me even more)but that he
didn't want to listen to me say the same things over
again. at this point, I'm just too fed up with him to
even care whether we work this out or not. well no...I DO
care- I love him and want to be with him but he's just
being SUCH a jerk. He basically told me that I was being
a bi!@# because I cared so much. how can person care too
much? at this point it became too much for me and I hung
up on him. My sister wrote him an email telling him how
much he's hurting me and how stupid he's being (she's on
my side luckily :)) - maybe that will get to
him...basically all he wants is to salvage our
friendship, but I have such a hard time seeing him EVERY
day as "friends" and getting over him. Its
impossible. The only way I can get past this is to not
see him for a while- and then maybe we could work a
friendship out of the whole mess. but not now. and I KNOW
that when I tell him that he'll get so mad again. *sigh*
I care sooo much about him...I want to work everything
out but he's just being SO difficult- and I know he
thinks I'm being difficult too. we're both just so
stubborn. what I don't understand is how we could be SO
close and then he just backed out all of a sudden...and I
know him well enough to know it wasn't all sexual for
him- it was more than that. I just don't know
WHAT....he's being so awful to me and if he were anyone
else I would tell them to never see me again but its so
hard with him...I know that he's just as mad as me- I
just wish we could see eye to eye. that's the biggest
problem here- neither of us can see the other's side. the
fact that he's even getting defensive and upset about all
this tells me that he DOES care...I'm just too
confused...I've been crying ever since he called...I
shouldn't let it get to me so much- but we were such good
friends before all this, and we were SUCH a wonderful
couple...I don't want to lose him. but I can't take it
anymore. maybe this will help you understand a little
more...thanks for trying to help :)
From: cindy
Hi again, well after your second posting there could
be a number of reasons why he doesn't want any romantic
involvement with you. I will be very blunt with you, so
if I hurt your feelings in any way, I'm sorry. First of
all, he's 18 years old, what he is doing hanging around
your sister and her friends is not normal in my eyes. A
young man of 18 should be out with his own group of
friends. You mentioned only having sex once. Maybe he has
a problem with his sexuality and can't admit it. I'm not
saying he's gay or anything, but maybe he just doesn't
know. Your sexual drive at 18 and being a man is suppose
to be very high, but again maybe someone like Bernd can
respond to that question because I'm obviously not a man.
Second, he isn't giving much thought or care for how you
feel. He just want's to be around your sister and her
friends, so if I were you, I would let him go. Why hang
on to someone who doesn't feel the same. You say he does
care, but not the way you do. And by you pushing him into
talking to you, he knows he won't tell you want you want
to hear, so he's trying to prevent this, by not talking
to you at all where your relationship is concerned. My
advise is to completely BACK OFF. GIVE HIM LOTS OF SPACE
AND GET ON WITH YOUR LIFE. I don't know how old you are
but their are alot of decent men who will treat you with
love and respect as you deserve. On my last thought, he
feels like he doesn't FIT IN ANYMORE, look at this as a
sign, and be careful because you are the one who will end
up hurting. Take care and let me know how things are.
From: Jess
thank you so much cindy :) your posting helped me a
LOT- I've been telling myself the same things you said
and I'm finally getting past all this. I DO still love
him but I think I love what we HAD, rather than what he's
become. the day after I wrote my last post he ended up
coming over for a talk- but only because my sister had
told him to. I basically explained to him that I didn't
want him in my life, that to completely get past this he
had to stop coming over all the time. He got very upset
about this and spent a few HOURS trying to convince me to
just be friends, that I could get past it by just being
friends. and as much as I care about him...I don't WANT
to be friends with him anymore...he has problems...I
don't know what they are or WHY but they're definitely
there. eventually he gave up and we both went home,
upset. he came over yesterday and the day before to see
my sister and has been polite to me..but hasn't treated
me like his FRIEND...I want to salvage our friendship...I
love him so much still but being best friends again would
be so strange..after all that's happened between us it
simply can't happen right now, and it DOES upset me very
much. I'm getting over this finally :) very slowly and
I'm STILL not past it but I will be soon :) I would still
give anything just to hear him say he loves me but
obviously he can't do that for some reason...he's SO good
at friendship and the beginnings of a relationship but so
terrible at intimacy- MENTAL intimacy. Anyways...I'm just
babbling on :) mostly just getting my OWN thoughts
together for all of you to read :) oh well :) thanks for
"listening". I really appreciate it- this group
has helped me a lot.
From: cindy
I can feel the hurt your going throught right about
now, but believe me it will pass. The sooner you realize
it's over and that meens not having false hopes in your
mind, the sooner you'll be able to fully consentrate on
what you need. He is not what you need, by his actions
he's displayed to you (coming over even though you asked
him not to because of this hurting you) he is very
insensative and obviously thinks of only himself. You did
the right thing. I would talk to your sister and let her
know just how much its hurting you by seeing him, she may
be only 13 but she should understand. Be more demanding
to both of them and ask them nicely if they could see
each other elsewhere until you can come to terms with
your feelings. My guess is when you start dating other
people, these feelings will slowly dissapear. Sometimes
it takes meeting someone new who treats you how you need
to be treated to realize just how stupid you were about a
past love. Again, I hope you the best, and I'm so glad I
could help.
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